Harvonsgard wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 4:33 pm
Correct me if I'm wrong but to my understanding the rewards for Gold Patreons are as follows:
First mentioned the foiled version of general release - second the exclusive offering.
Year 1 = Royal Silk - Patrons
Year 2 = TBA - Golden Rule
Year 3 = Sanctissimus - TBA
Correct?
Year 1 Patreon Rewards
• Royal Silk Red
• Royal Silk Red - Gold/Silver (Gift deck)
• Patrons
Year 2 Patreon Rewards
• Golden Rule
• Royal Patrons
Year 3 Patreon Rewards
• Sanctissimus Collector's Edition
• ???
Disenchanted_11 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 8:01 pm
Can anyone ELI5 what is so unique with lotrek's decks that it's running with a lot of issues/delay? Just out of curiosity at this point. Thank you!
Lotrek is a victim of his own perfectionism. Some of the decks he's tried in the past have required him to explore new techniques, varnishes, stocks, which have resulted in trial and error in order to come up with a finished product that meets his standards. He oversees the printing process directly and can make changes with the artwork through this process as well, as he shifts from the digital to the physical format.
With all this said, his primary reason for delays was due to the printing of Royal Silk, which required 21 plates. I'm not sure the average number of plates used for any given project, but 21 seems quite significant. Making sure they're lined up to create the extremely intricate patterns and foil registration requires a high level of precision. Going by his word, he can print non-foiled decks and even 2 foiled decks within a matter of days at the printing press, but there's plenty in the process that prolongs the timelines, with the aforementioned deck being a significant factor to this, coupled with his perfectionism.
Disenchanted_11 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 8:01 pm
Can anyone ELI5 what is so unique with lotrek's decks that it's running with a lot of issues/delay? Just out of curiosity at this point. Thank you!
Lotrek is a victim of his own perfectionism. Some of the decks he's tried in the past have required him to explore new techniques, varnishes, stocks, which have resulted in trial and error in order to come up with a finished product that meets his standards. He oversees the printing process directly and can make changes with the artwork through this process as well, as he shifts from the digital to the physical format and then back to the drawing board at times.
With all this said, his primary reason for delays was due to the printing of Royal Silk, which required 21 plates. I'm not sure the average number of plates used for any given project, but 21 seems quite significant. Making sure they're lined up to create the extremely intricate patterns and foil registration requires a high level of precision. Going by his word, he can print non-foiled decks and even 2 foiled decks within a matter of days at the printing press, but there's plenty in the process that prolongs the timelines, with the aforementioned deck being a significant factor to this, coupled with his perfectionism.
With the lots of excellent foiling techniques, card stocks, finishes, etc.. out there, is he basically trying to combine the best of them all?
Like from other discussions out there, having excellent foil means sacrificing the finish...
Disenchanted_11 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 8:39 pm
With the lots of excellent foiling techniques, card stocks, finishes, etc.. out there, is he basically trying to combine the best of them all?
Like from other discussions out there, having excellent foil means sacrificing the finish...
I can't speak for others and I'm no expert in finishes/varnishes, but I personally don't buy Lotrek decks for their handling/stock. I buy them for the art, presentation, and technical achievements. I do see an improvement in his overall finish over the years. Hopefully others can chime in too.
Disenchanted_11 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 8:01 pm
Can anyone ELI5 what is so unique with lotrek's decks that it's running with a lot of issues/delay? Just out of curiosity at this point. Thank you!
He actually does mention the difficulties he faces, especially with hot foil. I posted the link to the Deckin Around interview back in page 10 of this very thread. It's a very informative interview that any one curious about hot foiling should check out. Can't recall if he mentions it or not, but ordering the paper stock if there's any misprints also takes time for the printers to import over to Greece.
Enjoy!
Go check out Deckin Around's recent 24hr run with Lotrek here. I realized I never saw it after reading this thread last week.
Turns out Lotrek explained in detail all the delays he faced/s AND he shows you the sample of the decks he's done. You can see the gilded Maestro with borders, a sample of the old and current double gold foiled Royal Silk. It starts at min 13 onwards and takes about 10 minutes.
when updates such as this are stated, Lotrék really needs to be held accountable and not allow multiple weeks; turn into months before we see anything.
How much more monies do you need before we actually see our PROPER year 1,2, and 3 Patron decks
Is the Patrons Redemption deck supposed to be the final deck for Y1 Patreon reward but due to some errors Lotrek is changing it or is it something else. Planning to place my order but due to various issues I have dropped Oath Patreon so I cant keep up with the news . This one will be a foiled Patrons deck right ?
zlexander wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 1:17 am
Is the Patrons Redemption deck supposed to be the final deck for Y1 Patreon reward but due to some errors Lotrek is changing it or is it something else. Planning to place my order but due to various issues I have dropped Oath Patreon so I cant keep up with the news . This one will be a foiled Patrons deck right ?
Yes, it's what would have been the Year 1 reward, but due to some errors and patrons voting for a reprint, this became a "test print" or "first print" and is shipping as Redemption VI, with a revised version due as a Year 1 reward. I believe it's a public post on his Patreon.
Yes, it's what would have been the Year 1 reward, but due to some errors and patrons voting for a reprint, this became a "test print" or "first print" and is shipping as Redemption VI, with a revised version due as a Year 1 reward. I believe it's a public post on his Patreon.
The post is public but unfortunately I cant comment since Im not an existing Patron , this deck will be foiled right? Cuz Im not interested in buying a non foiled test print run at this moment. The deck looks cool and was the info regarding Royal Patrons posted later as I dont remember any post regarding it when I was a member in his Patreon.
zlexander wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 2:21 am
this deck will be foiled right?
Correct. It's foiled. Apart from the issues Lotrek mentioned (uncovered spots with the foil and a slight bend on the cards), it's essentially what was going to be the Year 1 reward.
Correct. It's foiled. Apart from the issues Lotrek mentioned (uncovered spots with the foil and a slight bend on the cards), it's essentially what was going to be the Year 1 reward.
As a patron I am perfectly happy supporting the artist and not weighing them down. I will be buying these as well, so as far as I’m concerned he is making stuff for me when he makes these, just like my patreon rewards.
GandalfPC wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2023 10:45 am
As a patron I am perfectly happy supporting the artist and not weighing them down. I will be buying these as well, so as far as I’m concerned he is making stuff for me when he makes these, just like my patreon rewards.
I hear what you are saying Gandalf but objectively it doesn’t appear that way. If you look back at how many players sales have happened vs rewards there is a distinct trend.
Listen, as long as people are happy I guess it doesn’t matter but optically it looks strange.
Ye I'm all for supporting Lotrek's work through Patreon. But at some point it's like Patreon subscribers have been an afterthought. Part of the reason he's able to print so many of these players edition decks is from Patreon funds, yet Patreon supporters are still waiting for 3+ years for stuff that keeps getting delayed over and over again. As a Patreon, I don't care about these players edition decks. I'm excited for the fancy foiled versions. But they just always seem to be leapfrogged by standard decks. Not saying don't do players edition decks. Just fulfil your Patreon promises, then do as many players decks as you want for people who aren't supporting you monthly for 3 years.
Looking to buy (DM me if selling please!):
-Limbo v1 decks: Escape, Ennui, Cage
-2018 NPCCD: Green Pawn & Missing Island Prototypes
This comment is mod-approved if you're able to see it.
We also have to remember the vast majority of patrons voted for a reprint of the Year 1 Patron's deck, so that vote has created further delay. On the upside, I would guess there is a Sanctissimus Redemption likely given Year 1 hasn't shipped and he mentioned multiple reprints of this one.
I completely understand the frustration some patrons are feeling. I count myself amongst that group at times. That said, it can be helpful to think about how things have progressed from Lotrek’s point of view.
All of the un-foiled decks that he has produced as of late are produced on an independent track from the foiled decks. In some cases, these decks are actually the required canvasses that will eventually become the foiled versions. He can only work on the foiled decks when he is given access to the printing workshop. While it would be ideal If he had unlimited access to the needed printing facilities to crank out the Patron rewards, that is just not the reality right now. He has used his time away from the printing press to design and produce special players editions as an added value for his Patrons. Selling publicly available versions of these decks has in no way equated to a longer delay, and frankly it just makes good business sense to get some added value out of the work he put into them. I understand that it is not a good look from an outside perspective. However, if you really think about his process, it is not the careless slight to Patrons that it is being made out to be by some. Quite the opposite; these decks were made for Patrons to provide us with something special while we wait for him to gain the access he needs to the printing press.
But at the same time I’m not sure where all the printing press time went considering. Patreons were told more press-time, would help him essentially catch-up with the backlogs of projects.
If I recall, wasn’t it bumped up to 3-4days a week (min.)
I could be wrong. If it’s not at least 2-3days a week, more often then not, projects will have a hard time completing on any 1day per/week timetable. Not saying he is, but sure does feel like it sometimes.
I also want to chomp at; sometimes seeing complainers come here to b!tch does get annoying more often then not but sometimes these complaints are valid fwiw. The delay on Vol.VI is not good considering the feedback given to us, but with anything I’m sure Lotrék has a decorous plan. So go easy on dbl_left?!
Anywho, keep up the good work Lotrék. I’m sure things will progress as they need be.
@playingcardophile
