ENUMA PLAYING CARDS

[STLBluesNut]

Perhaps I am too easy going or I just look at some things wrongly. I haven't gone back and researched the whole situation again before typing this post, but as far as i remember, the factory that was going to print these had a fire or something that was going to severely delay the project.

If i remember correctly, the creator let this be known and chose to go with a different printer to attempt to remain close to schedule. At least in his mind, he was doing what he thought was right for the backers. There were 2 paths to take. Use original printer with large delay or change printer and deliver sooner. Either way, both broke and kept the original scope of the project. He chose what he thought was the lesser of 2 evils.

If there hadn't been a problem with the original printer and he just up and changed to save money or something, that would be a different story.

As most of us here it seems, I am a collector. There are varying levels of card usage within that category. I am the open every deck, fool with the cards a little, put them back in the box for display. Look at them periodically out of the box, perhaps even play with some of them.

I buy a deck overall based on if it is a design I like. I would buy it priced appropriately whether it is USPCC or MPC, based on the design of the cards and box. I will pay more for certain features. Foil, embossing, metallic inks. I am not going to pay more for any deck than I think it is worth in its design and features because of printer.

I'll use Nicolai as an example because he has been mentioned here. I liked his last KS and I pledged for it because I thought for what it offered it was priced ok. I wouldn't have paid another $5 per deck if it was USPCC. Same as if Giovani used a different printer for the Odissea series, I still would have paid the same amount with that tuck and art because I like it.

Perhaps, like I said, I am too easy going or perhaps I'm just not as sophisticated, but this doesn't bother me at all. It is not like this was some health food product that they ended up loading down with sugar and corn syrup because the stevia factory burned down. Or some fancy unicorn jerky that they ended up using chicken instead because it was cheaper. In my judgement, it wasn't anything done maliciously to purposely screw anyone over. I feel like he was doing his best to do what he felt was the right thing.

In my opinion, these are decks for collectors that are going to sit on shelves and look pretty. I understand the printer can have a large impact on handling and performance, but who here actually pledged for these to use for magic or cardistry? I would feel safe betting money that the answer is nobody. That's not what these were for.

I know there are some that have beef with this out of principle of the printer change. I know that some here just have problems with certain printers for their own reasons. Really, ask yourself, for a design and tuck that you like how much extra are you really willing to pay for a "better" printer for them to sit in a display? $2? $3? $5... $10? I wouldn't pay the 5 or 10 bucks more. Maybe I would for the right DESIGN. Again, it comes down to design. And if your answer is down at the 2 or 3 dollar level, are you really that pissed about $6?

Anyway, this is just me. For me, in this case, the printer isn't that big of a deal. The tucks in the update ended up looking great, I think he even ended up using an extra color foil on each tuck. No one complaining about that change.

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[Bradius]

It was actually the firm that did fulfillment, not the printers. I don't know if this impacts all of their work though, but it is possible. I just wanted to be clear that the fire was the fulfillment vendor, not the printers. The fire destroyed among others all of the Ambassador Standards that were not sold on Kickstarter, which was a huge financial hit to Lotrek. and I am sure a lot of others.

[STLBluesNut]

I suppose most of my post is moot now isn't it lol.

It did say that LPCC had a warehouse fire so they had to print in a different facility near Hong Kong. Sounds like LPCC has/uses 2 facilities. This was going to cause a 6 week delay.

Either way, from what I can read in the updates this fire was going to cause a 6 week delay, plus 5 weeks of transit time, adding 6 to 11 weeks, he chose a different printer to keep near schedule.

I give the benefit of the doubt that he did it to stay on schedule, thereby benefiting the backers in his mind, rather than some malicious act to scam or screw anyone.

I'm not trying to say anyone is right or wrong here, I was just finally voicing my opinion on how I thought about the situation. I feel like I will enjoy these decks as much as from NPCC as from LPCC and I don't think it was a malicious decision.

And Brad, I know you weren't attacking me or anything. It's all good. That does suck for all that took a loss from that fire.

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[Bradius]

I was just trying to clarify what happened. I agree with your position. I guess we are the softies. I am cool with that.

That said, I am likely not backing the creator until I see some changes in how he does things. Likely I will skip and buy it on the secondary market or aftermarket retail. Hopefully he will step up his game later and stick to what he says, even if it means delays.

He should look at how VXD, Lotrek and so many others handle production setbacks successfully.

[STLBluesNut]

It's all good.

I think also being a first time creator he underestimated how passionate some are about particular printers. I believe he thought he was making the best choice.

I think the number of people asking for refunds will teach him the hard way. It will be a hard pill to swallow, but I hope he is giving the refunds to those that want them.

Perhaps because I am fairly new to this hobby, although less starry eyed than I was, there just aren't many things that bother me too much if I really like the design. I don't mind full art. I don't mind one way backs or courts. Printer isn't much of an issue for me.

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[Bradius]

I am not anything close to a cardist, but start handling different decks at the same time. Even decks made by the same manufacturer with different finishes. I think you will be surprised to find that you can quickly tell a USPCC deck from the others, and also a Cartamundi B9 deck as well. It isn't that hard at all. I do get what folks say about USPCC handling. I was surprised how easily my untrained hands could tell a USPCC deck from others.

[theCapraAegagrus]

Delivering what you advertise is more important than delivering within an estimated timeline.

As an automotive supplier Design Engineer, if I released a crappy product "on-time", we will LOSE BUSINESS. If we deliver a Grade-A product a week late, then we just file it under "lessons learned".

Accuracy is more important than speed.

[vasta41]

Delivering what you advertise is more important than delivering within an estimated timeline.

As an automotive supplier Design Engineer, if I released a crappy product "on-time", we will LOSE BUSINESS. If we deliver a Grade-A product a week late, then we just file it under "lessons learned".

Accuracy is more important than speed.

What's equally concerning to me is the way the creator acted when facing criticism of his decision. He has made no attempt to care for anyone's opinion but his own. It's one thing if he's doing something that he believes is right. But it's another thing entirely to ignore all other feedback opposed to his decision. I find that to be the cause of a very, very large ego.

I will not bother posting the conversations I've had with him via KS PMs suffice to say all I did was ask for a refund in lieu of the decks. Curious as to why I questioned the difference between NPCC and EPCC, I explained and re-asked for a refund. I never once acted unprofessional, called him names, etc. But he (and Brad for some reason) seem to think I'm "thrashing" or acting irrationally. I paid for one thing, I'm being sold another, I want a refund. I don't see what I'm doing wrong? Instead I'm being treated as if I'm a moron for thinking EPCC and NPCC produce different cards. MY GOD.

[macstrat]

Full Deck Scans:

Elder - https://www.flickr.com/photos/167981955 ... 9093919711
Ancient - https://www.flickr.com/photos/167981955 ... 9093718047

[chicken_ql]

Yikes 25 euros for a deck before shipping is a hefty price for the elish deck especially from a new creator.

[vasta41]

Yikes 25 euros for a deck before shipping is a hefty price for the elish deck especially from a new creator.

... especially for an NPCC deck...

[chicken_ql]

Yikes 25 euros for a deck before shipping is a hefty price for the elish deck especially from a new creator.

... especially for an NPCC deck...

Agreed

[macstrat]

Yikes 25 euros for a deck before shipping is a hefty price for the elish deck especially from a new creator.

This is exactly why I didnt get one. That and I cant f*cking stand when new decks are stretch goals.

[venomatic]

I'm digging the art but yeah, given the cost, I doubt I'll be picking up any one of the three decks

[Bradius]

That and I cant f*cking stand when new decks are stretch goals.

Having new decks as stretch goals is not that uncommon as it costs a lot to make another run of decks and it needs a certain volume to make it work. It is often easier for a creator to put an initial deck/decks out there for a smaller goal, and then stretch to open up a new deck design. If it isn't reached, it can either be forgotten or run another kickstarter after the initial decks are delivered in the hopes those that got the first one are ready for more.

TGW issued additional decks as stretch goals, two decks actually. Again, it is not that unusual.

All that said, I do get all the concerns on this campaign. I am looking forward to getting my decks, but have not backed Claude since. We will see how I feel about these decks once I have them in hand, but I am not happy about the change in printer either after the campaign closed.

[macstrat]

That and I cant f*cking stand when new decks are stretch goals.

Having new decks as stretch goals is not that uncommon as it costs a lot to make another run of decks and it needs a certain volume to make it work.
...
TGW issued additional decks as stretch goals, two decks actually. Again, it is not that unusual.

Didnt get those decks either, for the same reason. When I pledge a deck, I like to know that Im getting the best that creator has to offer. When a "luxury" or "limited edition" deck gets released after pledging, it really puts me off to that creator. As a backer it makes me feel like I had the rug pulled out from under me by not getting the best they can do. All of a sudden, your just bog standard. Upgrade the stocks, finishes, add gilding, foil, embossed tucks, etc. to the main decks first. Offer a free booklet to all backers about the deck. Something that makes it feel like I was part of the project to help make it the best it can be instead of just pushed off to the side. Its been my experience that usually if you arent pledging $150 or more to a project, you get left in the dust.

I dont mind adding a little extra for unique items, like the TGW gaff pack, mini decks, or adding on other decks from the creators past projects at the end, but making it feel like we are almost obligated to shell out an extra, usually $30, on top of everything else to fulfill a need for completeness is kinda shitty.

[vasta41]

Has anyone received these yet? I was told that I cannot receive my refund until after the decks have gone out for delivery (Why? I'm sure I don't know). So I need to ask Claude for my refund (again) but I don't want to bruise his tender ego.

[Bradius]

I don’t know about others, but I received mine about a week or two ago. As you know though, it takes awhile for fulfillment to finish.

[akicer]

I got my refund months ago, by asking Chase bank though

[PrincessTrouble]

I have received neither the deck nor the refund that I asked for three times.

[vasta41]

I have received neither the deck nor the refund that I asked for three times.

Ditto. If this guy doesn't get back to me soon I think he might top Natalia as my most hated playing card designer.

[STLBluesNut]

Sorry to hear the troubles others are having. I got my decks a few weeks ago it seems.

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[Eric Lee]

Yikes 25 euros for a deck before shipping is a hefty price for the elish deck especially from a new creator.

For those who like the deck for the mythology, you can wait for fulfillment to complete and see when NPCC offers it on their store. https://noir-arts.com/#welcome" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

If you scroll down the home page, you will see that NPCC also offers BF/CM sales which will help offset the high shipping costs.

[vasta41]

After ignoring me for 4 months Claude finally came out of the woodwork to tell me he wouldn't be giving me a refund because, basically I'm a moron for thinking two totally different printing companies are two totally different printing companies.
Let this be a warning to everyone: DO NOT EVER BACK "NEMESIS" PROJECTS. Claude is a narcissistic, stubborn and delusional person who will swindle you out of your hard earned money.

Again, DO NOT BACK CLAUDE.

[Bradius]

So, Vasta, it would then be reasonable to assume that if he is not giving you a refund that he is sending you the rewards that you backed for his project? So, you can a) Burn them and post it on Youtube with a rant about Claude, b) sell them as fast as you can, or c) something else. If he isn't sending you your rewards or a refund, then he is no different in your case than Natalia Silva. No refund. No rewards.

I have not opened any of his decks, but I did open an Ephemrid deck this week. They are decent playing cards. However, they do not slip well compared to Cartamundi and USPCC. If I was a cardist, I would not be happy with this deck. As more of a collector, I am okay with it, but still sad that the stated reason was it was going to take more time to get printed with Cartamundi. I can deal with delays a lot better than I can poor quality. Especially since he really sold us that these would be printed by Cartamundi. It is sad that his start ended up going so sideways. I haven't backed his latest campaign, which I really felt was just a recolor of the originals anyway.

[MagikFingerz]

After ignoring me for 4 months Claude finally came out of the woodwork to tell me he wouldn't be giving me a refund because, basically I'm a moron for thinking two totally different printing companies are two totally different printing companies.
Let this be a warning to everyone: DO NOT EVER BACK "NEMESIS" PROJECTS. Claude is a narcissistic, stubborn and delusional person who will swindle you out of your hard earned money.

Again, DO NOT BACK CLAUDE.

Not giving a refund to you when you ask for it is bad enough, but stringing you along with the promise of you getting your refund when the rewards have been sent out is beyond scummy. What a terrible person.

[chicken_ql]

So, Vasta, it would then be reasonable to assume that if he is not giving you a refund that he is sending you the rewards that you backed for his project? So, you can a) Burn them and post it on Youtube with a rant about Claude, b) sell them as fast as you can, or c) something else. If he isn't sending you your rewards or a refund, then he is no different in your case than Natalia Silva. No refund. No rewards.

I have not opened any of his decks, but I did open an Ephemrid deck this week. They are decent playing cards. However, they do not slip well compared to Cartamundi and USPCC. If I was a cardist, I would not be happy with this deck. As more of a collector, I am okay with it, but still sad that the stated reason was it was going to take more time to get printed with Cartamundi. I can deal with delays a lot better than I can poor quality. Especially since he really sold us that these would be printed by Cartamundi. It is sad that his start ended up going so sideways. I haven't backed his latest campaign, which I really felt was just a recolor of the originals anyway.

What's his latest campaign?

[Bradius]

My bad. I think I was confusing Enuma with Ephemerid/Mr. Cup. Claude has not done another Kickstarter. Mr. Cup did another variation on Ephemerid, which I didn't back. Sorry, I got the campaigns mixed up in my mind.

[vasta41]

So, Vasta, it would then be reasonable to assume that if he is not giving you a refund that he is sending you the rewards that you backed for his project? So, you can a) Burn them and post it on Youtube with a rant about Claude, b) sell them as fast as you can, or c) something else. If he isn't sending you your rewards or a refund, then he is no different in your case than Natalia Silva. No refund. No rewards.

I have not opened any of his decks, but I did open an Ephemrid deck this week. They are decent playing cards. However, they do not slip well compared to Cartamundi and USPCC. If I was a cardist, I would not be happy with this deck. As more of a collector, I am okay with it, but still sad that the stated reason was it was going to take more time to get printed with Cartamundi. I can deal with delays a lot better than I can poor quality. Especially since he really sold us that these would be printed by Cartamundi. It is sad that his start ended up going so sideways. I haven't backed his latest campaign, which I really felt was just a recolor of the originals anyway.

Sorry, I did not specify (there were many PMs and I didn't feel it was necessary to get into all of them). He told me that he is sending me the cards. Even though I do not trust Claude and I'm very upset with him he is nowhere near the level Natalia is. She is the lowest of the low; at least Claude is responsive (albeit after 4 months and a lot of prodding on my part) and at least I'm receiving *something* from him.
He advertised one thing and sold another. Period. End of story. And what's worse is that he fails to realize that's not how to run a business. Not to mention that the supposed reason he switched printers was to avoid delays but still delivered the decks 5 months late (assuming I get the decks soon as he said).
I can't stop people from pledging for his projects but I can tell you my opinion as a professional playing card collector (if there is such a thing?) and a KS "power backer." And that is to stay away from Claude.

[akicer]

Feel sorry to hear that vasta.. I asked my credit company to issue a refund right away (because they won't issue a refund 3 month aftehr payment made), and I got my refund and a cancelled status on kickstarter...

I did not trust the guy that he will refund me at the end of the campaign at all because 1. it makes no sense to wait 2. he has no credit at all given what he have done... A good lesson learned